It’s been over a year since Israeli government officials announced that they were going to starve Gaza. They hold up aid for no reason. They massacred people collecting flour. They destroyed aid convoys they knew about and coordinated with. They have been doing exactly what they said they would and all America has done is make them pinky swear it would get better.

They will do nothing about this. Not because they will believe the lies Israel tells, but because they fundamentally do not care.

I really didn’t.

Edit: meaning I am not American and if I was I would have voted Harris, not that Trump is not significantly worse.

Over 50% of the god damn country voted for a man who has so many major, should-be career ending flaws we don’t even need to list them anymore. If he kicked a puppy it wouldn’t even make the top 10 worst things he’s done. The democrats lost to the stupidest president of all time, a man who’s entire economic policy revolves around tariffs that he fundamentally doesn’t even understand and who cannot seem to open his mouth without lying.

…and you’re here dunking on the people trying to oppose America’s blatant complicity in genocide. Well, you sure showed them.

“Yes, my candidate is Mussolini, but her opponent is Hitler! Clearly a vote for Mussolini is better than a vote for Hitler!”

Why would you be criticising Mussolini if you didn’t secretly want Hitler to win?! I cannot possibly come up with any other explanation. You must be trying to trick us.

You mean antagonizing European football fans can result in violence?

Maybe Trek was just a few years off on the Bell Riots

Absolutely! I don’t think that is necessarily implied by not endorsing, that’s all

I don’t think not endorsing is the same as saying vote for someone else. I won’t endorse McDonald’s but if I’m starving with no other option I would have to eat it.

The Sweden Democrats, once an openly Nazi but now a “not Nazis we promise” party are in the government. Like all “not Nazis” they spend most of their time looking for nebulous reasons to remove foreigners from the country.

We should have acted a year ago

Israelis concerned about morality should refuse to serve in the IDF at all and take the jail time instead.

For those who didn’t, they obviously believe in what they’re doing to some extent and I’m not convinced that the incentives are really there to do the right thing. What is the consequence for committing the war crime? It is non existent. Straight up. So if you risk punishment by refusing, why would you?

Again, if you have morals you should lay down your arms and fucking leave Gaza immediately. Refusing one order is pointless when there are war crimes committed every day.

Booby trapping civilian areas* is really bad because it puts innocent civilians at risk. Now, you’ve already written two comments on this but not one condemning the use of civilians as literal human shields. So you’re welcome to do so any time now…

*Tunnels are fair game imo, not intended for civilians, but anyway

You really don’t seem to understand how bad this makes you look. Using human shields is fine now apparently? Did you ever have principles or do you find that they get in the way of your blind hatred?

Refrain? Lol. Urgghh ahh my trigger finger… I can’t… hold… it… back…

Get the fuck out of here.

Anyway, super cool and great that Russia gets this easy win because US leaders are too fucking cowardly to stand up to the cunt in the room.

Can’t wait for the Times of Israel headline:

Israeli forces fire at UN peacekeeper terrorist positions in south Lebanon, peacekeepers say IDF says

What is he going to do? Say no to Israel? Lol

I remember watching the news interviews at the time, and some of the people who voted to Exit said they didn’t really want to Exit they just wanted to put out a protest vote against Corbyn.

You are literally talking out of your arse. “Some” people may have been protesting Corbyn… not saying much?.. about it. But Cameron was the face of remain. He was the logical target for a protest vote. And if you really did watch the interviews around the time of Brexit and especially the exit polls after the election you would know that most people said some nonsense about “sovereignty” but the next most common and incredibly obvious reason was immigration. The idea that is was primarily or even substantially about Corbyn is completely ludicrous.

So go ahead and single issue vote on something that will get you more of what you don’t want.

1. I am actually British. 2. I would vote for Harris and have literally said as much throughout this conversation.

I am just saying I understand their perspective and pointing out that this “Trump is worse” response completely ignores the overwhelming moral case for opposing a genocide. It is pathetic as a response to what people are saying. It’s myopically election focused at a time when people are dying with full US backing.

Yes, Clinton was a shitty candidate who I predicted losing because everyone hates her so much… but in the end there were a lot of people who are now worse off because they decided it would be better to vote for Stein.

So you predicted she would lose, and many other people did, and the DNC did not listen. Then some people didn’t see the gravity of the situation and made bad voting decisions, absolutely. But they are just random people who may be more engaged with work and paying their bills than they are with making unintuitive voting decisions. Partially their fault, mainly the dems fault

Yeah but when the single issue is genocide? I don’t know, I can understand the moral argument that is always wrong to support that. I can understand not wanting your tax dollars to pay for the death and destruction we’ve been watching for the past year.

I understand your point, don’t agree with single issue voting in most cases and I also wouldn’t vote third party or encourage anyone to do so BUT I can see the point and lecturing people about Trump does nothing whatsoever to address it.

Look at Brexit: most of those were protest votes against Labour, not actual votes for Brexit.

Lol I can only assume you are not British. Protesting Labour in the 6th year of a conservative government for… what exactly? There are a lot of stupid things that led to the Brexit vote but this is not one of them.

Every pregnant woman in the US is at higher risk now because of those protest votes.

No. Because the democrats did not win over enough voters to take the presidency. They ran a candidate people didn’t like that much and lost. That is on THEM.

Ha stupid Palestinians not wanting to vote for someone who promised to continue arming the state that is killing their families! Wow what idiots. Do they want a Trump presidency? What dumb dumbs, they clearly don’t understand democracy: you vote for us otherwise it’ll get even worse.

Pressuring their preferred candidate to change their policies by saying they’ll vote third party because of this issue? NO! The only way is slavish loyalty, that way they’ll know they can do what they want and it won’t affect their vote share.

Jokes aside: I do think Harris is better on this issue (and people should still vote for her) but surely you can see how this disingenuous criticism really side steps the issue. What if it was your family, so you tried to push change on this issue with your only tangible democratic power and then some jumped up boot licker starts lecturing you on how this is actually stupid because the other guy will kill your family FASTER? I would tell that person to fuck all the way off.

No, I’m just saying the graph is probably useless. Israel definitely is launching more and larger attacks, because that’s how you win a war.

How can the graph be useless if it shows a point you agree with, that Israel is launching more and larger attacks?

Is this a joke? Hezbollah usually attacks with unguided rockets. This demonstrates zero concern for civilian casualties. Less than zero, actually, because the intent of the attacks is to cause civilian casualties. Relatively few Israeli civilians have died because Israel is successfully defending them, not because Hezbollah’s policy regarding Israeli civilians is different from that of Hamas.

Not joking. Just confused. Do you have a source for this about unguided rockets targeting civilians from Hezbollah?

This article among many others don’t mention this. In fact, according to them they are targeting troops and intelligence bases.

Hezbollah also fired more rockets and missiles into Israel - attacks that Mr Afif said were “only the beginning” of its response to Israel’s attacks.

Sirens sounded several times in the border town of Metula, where Hezbollah said its fighters had targeted Israeli troops with artillery and rocket fire without mentioning any incursion.

The group also claimed it had fired missiles towards two Israeli intelligence bases in the central Tel Aviv area. Paramedics said two people were injured on a highway near Kafr Qasim.

Much like with the IDF’s claims, I am not eager to believe what they say. I would just like to see the evidence for these unguided attacks because the death tolls and overall number of attacks do not seem to support this conclusion at all.

Even if that is true (and it would only be true in the short term) then Israel would still be foolish to make major concessions to its persistent enemies when it has the military power necessary not to. Meanwhile Hezbollah would be more inclined to launch future attacks because it would see that they worked.

The point is they don’t have to be persistent enemies. There can be peace, and the start of that is an actual two state solution. Given that the country was founded on ethnic cleansing, I totally understand why people in the region would see Israel as the enemy until they actually take genuine steps to rectify the situation. Currently, instead of this they are doing a genocide. And when this started is when Hezbollah started attacking, at least most recently. Not only that, they explicitly said that was why they attacked.

I am a bit concerned that your argument seems to be “why do peace and diplomacy when we can kill people until we’re safe?” It is incredibly short sighted to think that war can solve this persistent conflict. When was Hezbollah formed again? Oh yeah after Israel invaded Lebanon. So why would more war “solve” this issue rather than create new ones?

It’s easy to chest thump and drop bombs. Maybe it even makes you feel good. But all it does is guarantee more civilian deaths and displacement in future, on both sides.

Don’t you want the killing to end?